Part 15-180 and Part S190

Home Owner from USA

Aug 10, 2020 1:36 pm

I am being advised to use both the double and single detent clips. If I move down the double clips I use the top screw hole one the double and also screw in the single, that way the whole apparatus is lower down and won't be showing nor interfering with the tilt latch.

If it put the single clip above the double one it will show and be unsightly when the sash is in place. Any other options?

9 Replies

Tom from SWISCO

Aug 13, 2020 12:08 pm

I'm sorry, I'm a little confused. You can't use the single and double detent clip with the 15-180. This shoe is only designed to take two coils. You can't use three.

Did your original coil balance use triple coils? If so, then this hardware isn't what you want. I think maybe we should start over from the beginning so that I can have a better idea of what you're trying to do.

Home Owner from USA

Aug 13, 2020 3:49 pm

I was just as confused as you when I was given instructions on how to remedy my situation. From the beginning: I have a 45# window and was planning on using two 11# coils per side but your company doesn't have 11# coils. The max weight is 9# therefore I was told by a rep from Swisco to use two 9# coils and one 4# coil, screwing 2 coils on one side of the shoe and screwing in the other coil on the other side of the shoe. I was also told to use a double and single detent clip on each side since your company doesn't have triple clips.

So the first photo attached shows the position of the single clip in relation to the window frame, if I put it above the double one. I was told I would not need to screw it in. But this way, the tilt clip will not latch.

The 2nd photo is for illustration on my idea if I lower the double clip so that I am using the top screw hole on the double clip but in the bottom hole of the window frame. I would then screw in the single clip above that, in the top screw hole of the window frame. Therefore, the tilt latch will latch and the clip won't be seen. I hope that helps clarify. Would this work? If not, can you recommend a place that would have either a triple detent clip or 11# coils?

2 user uploaded images

Tom from SWISCO

Aug 14, 2020 9:32 am

Wow, 45 pounds is huge for this kind of window. I can understand why someone might have suggested going up to three coils, but I just don't think that's feasible for the 15-180 shoe. If that can work it would be a very tight and awkward fit. I just don't see it happening.

Give me a little time to confer with my colleagues about this. We'll do our best to find something that can work for you.

Tom from SWISCO

Aug 18, 2020 11:31 am

Thanks again for waiting. This one threw us through a loop, for sure. We tried all sorts of different combinations of shoes, springs, and everything in between, but there were two major road blocks:

The manufacturer does not make a Series 190 spring that can support 11 pounds. 9 pounds is the absolute strongest they can make. This is curious to me because your spring is obviously over 9 pounds, but that's what they told me and they seem pretty immovable on that detail.
The 15-180 shoe and Series 190 spring are too unique in terms of size. Other types of balances cannot replace them.

So, those are both obviously big problems. We don't have a spring that will support your extra-heavy sash and nothing we sell can work as a substitute. Frankly, I don't know why the original window installers used this style on your window to begin with. 45 pounds is just way too big for most coil springs. I really don't know what their plan was.

I personally think your best bet would be to contact the original makers of the window, if you can get a hold of them. I think whatever you had originally was unique to this particular window, which would account for why we can't find anything in that size.

The other solution would be to try to make 3 springs work, but I'm still not convinced that it will. It may be possible if you're handy and can drill a new hole for the extra detent clip, but I'm just not optimistic that it can work.

I'm very sorry that we can't be of more help. This one really stumped us.

Home Owner from USA

Aug 18, 2020 11:54 am

on that particular sash, the glass was replaced as the seals were bad so it is not the original window. perhaps the original one was lighter. Glass Doctor replaced the glass so maybe their's is heavier for some reason. i cannot find any labeling on any of the windows here. the home was built in 2003 in Colorado, that's all i know! i did order 2 of the 140 quick tilt triple coil setups as the depth and width of the "shoe" seemed to match what i am replacing. if that doesn't work, i'll look at the ghetto-rigged way with the original shoe.

Tom from SWISCO

Aug 18, 2020 1:24 pm

Ah, the old glass upgrade trick. That makes a lot of sense, and would explain everything.

Please let us know how the Series 140 works. My fear is that it may not be the right size, but if you can get it to fit then I'll make sure to add it to the books for future reference.

Handy Person from Colorado

Aug 25, 2020 7:35 pm

It worked! The 140-22 series triple coils worked perfectly although I had to open the window frame a bit to get it in. And I had to drill another screw hole but it's a success! I hope you add it to the file of solutions when the coils you have don't hold enough weight for the application. Here's some step by step pics...they may be Uploaded backwards though

5 user uploaded images

Tom from SWISCO

Aug 26, 2020 8:28 am

Awesome, thank you so much for the update! I will definitely file this one away for future reference.

If you ever need anything else, please let me know.